In this episode of Safety Spotlight, Dr. Joanna Pagonis, founder of Sinogap Solutions and author of Choose to Be a Leader Others Would Want to Follow, brings a bold and deeply human take on leadership. Drawing from her roots in psychology and a career spanning law enforcement and public service, Joanna shares how organizations can move from simply “managing” to truly leading—with empathy, courage, and intention.

“We talk about creating ‘safe spaces,’” she says. “But sometimes those are just echo chambers for the dominant group. Psychological safety starts with the self. You have to nurture the courage within to challenge the system.”

From confronting imposter syndrome to reframing safety as a team-based behavior, Joanna challenges conventional thinking on leadership, culture, and accountability—making the case that trust isn’t a nice-to-have, it’s a measurable business imperative. For more on Joanna’s philosophy and impact, explore her feature article: Revolutions in Safety.

Her message? If your safety culture isn’t brave, it isn’t safe. And if you’re promoting leaders for their technical chops alone, you’re missing the mark.